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Post by bizarro on Nov 22, 2009 11:13:57 GMT -5
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Post by jimschmidt on Nov 22, 2009 11:45:33 GMT -5
Let the compromising and vote buying begin!!!
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Post by jeromeoneil on Nov 22, 2009 12:02:14 GMT -5
It went in, but it's never coming out.
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Post by john on Nov 22, 2009 12:36:51 GMT -5
I would be curious to see what the lobbying spend looks like now from the healthcare industry and pharma.
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Post by bizarro on Nov 22, 2009 13:47:03 GMT -5
Facking HUGE.
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Post by grumpytoo on Nov 22, 2009 13:49:49 GMT -5
I would be curious to see what the lobbying spend looks like now from the healthcare industry and pharma. You know they could possibly fund healthcare reform with this. Tax on lobbying anyone? --chris |
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Post by kitkat on Nov 22, 2009 14:02:19 GMT -5
Just an FYI: There are THREE more 60 vote majority votes likely needed before this "reform" is a done deal on Obama's desk...
1) Cloture to end (after an additional 30 hours) the debate this instant vote began and thus allow amended bill to floor for a simple majority vote on passage in the senate.
2) Cloture to the debate (on the motion) to create a house/senate conference committee to combine house & senate verisons into a final bill
3) Cloture vote to stop the debate on the final conference bill.
Cloture votes end debates (after an additional 30 hours) in the senate which are otherwise unlimited (fillibuster).
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Post by kitkat on Nov 22, 2009 14:18:37 GMT -5
A ques: there are (about) 36million uninsured citizens in the US that are below retirement (medicare) age. Under either bill there will remain between 12-16 million uninsured citizens below medicare age after passage. So how will their situation change? Will such care as they are able to rustle up now be enhanced-- or reduced by new roadblocks? Will public hospitals still be required to care for these people who (illegally if bill passes) have no insurance? Will they be subject to prosecution? Persecution? Intensified collection efforts? (IRS?) Just wondering...
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Post by kitkat on Nov 22, 2009 14:35:52 GMT -5
Another Q: How is it that dems can claim that "Medicare won't be affected" if both bills mandate hundreds in billions of cuts to this very program? (400billion house version, 354 billion senate version) BTW, The CBO says it's "unclear" whether cuts "would reduce access to care or diminish the quality of care." Unclear? Unless there is a terrific amount of waste in this program (which medicare proponents argue there is not) where are the cuts coming from but services?
and another: If this reform is supposed to contain costs and the continuing rise thereof, why do both subsidize private insurance premiums for families & individuals up to four times the official poverty level (+88K/yr family of four, +43K/yr individual)? How is this *not* a public subsidy of already vastly inflated insurance industry premiums?
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Post by will on Nov 22, 2009 14:43:18 GMT -5
Well, there's going to be a whole lot of sunshine, isn't there, sunshine.  Sure, there will be the need for several more supermajority votes, but I'll take it one step at a time for now. It is completely flawed now, but it's not a done deal, either. The process is going to be ugly, no doubt, but as long as what we get is better than what we have now, I'm going to be happier than I was six months ago. |
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Post by kitkat on Nov 22, 2009 14:54:08 GMT -5
Well...your pathologically obese premiums won't be going down...but maybe you'll get some public help to keep on keeping on paying them! Doesn't anyone see the short-sighted ridiculousness of all this?  |
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Post by jeromeoneil on Nov 22, 2009 15:04:31 GMT -5
Just an FYI: There are THREE more 60 vote majority votes likely needed before this "reform" is a done deal on Obama's desk... 1) Cloture to end (after an additional 30 hours) the debate this instant vote began and thus allow amended bill to floor for a simple majority vote on passage in the senate. 2) Cloture to the debate (on the motion) to create a house/senate conference committee to combine house & senate verisons into a final bill 3) Cloture vote to stop the debate on the final conference bill. Cloture votes end debates (after an additional 30 hours) in the senate which are otherwise unlimited (fillibuster). So what are you saying here? That it went in, but it ain't coming out? |
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Post by kitkat on Nov 22, 2009 17:35:13 GMT -5
I'm saying that there are three more of these "60 votes or bust" dramas remaining to get through. "Are" rather than "may" *if* the repubs bother to filibuster every chance they get that is...(any bets they won't?)
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Post by jeromeoneil on Nov 22, 2009 23:46:22 GMT -5
I'm saying that there are three more of these "60 votes or bust" dramas remaining to get through. "Are" rather than "may" *if* the repubs bother to filibuster every chance they get that is...(any bets they won't?) So this thing never sees a floor vote. The blue dogs will see to that. |
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Post by jimschmidt on Nov 23, 2009 0:47:19 GMT -5
I'm not worried about that at all. The only question is what will be given away to pass it.
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